Fixes the Detective Revolver shooting .357 by default

[west3436]

What this does

Prevents the detective revolver from accepting and shooting .357 rounds without consequence. This restores the intended functionality of requiring you to either use a screwdriver on the revolver for a chance to explode in your hands while using .357 rounds or to use the conversion kit with no risk of exploding.

Why it's good

Closes #34628.

Changelog

🆑

• bugfix: The detective revolver can no longer fire .357 rounds without consequences if a conversion kit isn't used on it first.

[BomberBro]

According to my gun expert Irradiation a .357 revolver could fire .38 rounds just fine but a .38 revolver could NOT do the same. It's also weird and dumb to have the ability in the first place for any detective to get their own traitor revolver roundstart considering:

1. The conversion kit exists which is useless in all cases compared to a screwdriver that costs much, much less resources and effort
2. With the ammolathe it becomes trivial for sec to source lethal rounds

[SonixApache]

ten year old bug, finally fixed... the sec metaclub will remember this...

[jwhitak]

I'd rewrite this proc so that it goes through the easiest returns first, since this is combat-live and should process ASAP. Example

/obj/item/weapon/gun/projectile/detective/special_check(var/mob/living/carbon/human/M)
if(perfect) //perfectly modified gun always fires correctly
    return 1
var/dakka = getAmmo() //run the semi expensive proc once
if(!dakka) //out of dakka
    return 0
if(!istype(loaded[1], /obj/item/ammo_casing/a357)) //only 357 explodes
    return 1
if(!caliber[POINT357]) //Gun has 357 from above somehow but isn't modified at all
    return 0 //or, explosion! if explosion, combine with below if statement with OR
if(prob(70 - (dakka * 10))) /10% explode with 6 bullets, 60% with 1 (i don't like this balance but that's what it was supposed to be despite never working)
    boom code
else //passed all checks! fire dangerous gun!!!
    return 1

And tbh, 20 burn damage (*edit: to a random part of your body, vs your hand) and a silent qdel sucks. There's no light explosion, nor any boom noise. special_check triggers before the gun firing sound. Perhaps add a boom noise here, or even a light explosion?

[jwhitak]

Additionally, caliber is the variable used to determine what ammo a gun is allowed to load. A modified revolver is still supposed to be able to load and fire 38. Due to the terrible old code, it's no longer able to.

[SlashBolt]

Bad idea!

1. The conversion kit will still be useless since sec does not roll traitor very often.
2. Security has such a wide variety of weapons and an infinite ammo generator already that one additional lethal weapon is a drop in the bucket. The balance is supposed to be the IC and OOC rules that govern restraint in using it.
3. It's fun, I like my big Iron, it adds flavor.

[djkramer123]

detective having a lethal that isn't just the sec go to option of the shotgun is cool

[kilozombie]

1. The conversion kit will still be useless since sec does not roll traitor very often.

I think this is bad logic. It's currently completely useless because it doesn't do anything. If suddenly it was useful, then maybe people would buy it.

2. Security has such a wide variety of weapons and an infinite ammo generator already that one additional lethal weapon is a drop in the bucket. The balance is supposed to be the IC and OOC rules that govern restraint in using it.

Shotguns are worse than .357 magnum rounds. The revolver with .357 can kill you practically instantly. There's a reason that, as a traitor weapon, it costs the majority of your telecrystals, and is still--to this day--the go-to option for murderbone. It is objectively better than any other lethal option Sec has.

3. It's fun, I like my big Iron, it adds flavor.

You can just say this. You don't have to pretend you have reasons beyond "I like it"

That being said, I think that the conversion kit should be removed and we should just let Detectives screwdriver their gun, because it's cool.

[Theophrastus1]

This is an ancient bug that has existed for eons and the only reason it wasn't fixed, in my opinion, is because it was abused by det players.

[skelesexualstephen]

what % chance of exploding does it have?

[BomberBro]

>Security has such a wide variety of weapons and an infinite ammo generator already that one additional lethal weapon is a drop in the bucket. The balance is supposed to be the IC and OOC rules that govern restraint in using it.
Beyond what kilo said, the fact that security has shotguns in the armory (gated off by warden/HoS) doesn't mean rank and file security team members should get instant lethals, especially not antagonist tier lethals roundstart.

People claim a lot that detective is supposed to be a roleplay role, moreso than the rest of security, and I fail to see how encouraging people to make their gun lethal (even one bullet has a high chance to inflict IB and kill you) makes it roleplay more. The normal detective gun stuns people just fine and is PRETTY MUCH THE SAME IN SINGLE COMBAT AS THE 357, the major difference being that it gives people time to talk and you get the chance to go over and capture (or laser/toolbox). With a 357 you're encouraged to just kill people instead of capturing them (I've personally been magdumped three times in the last few weeks), and that's not something a real detective player should want. With a group of enemies the 357 is grotesque and stronger than even the lawgiver since it's supposed to be a traitor weapon.

[PrimeDSS13]

pretty much what bomber said
clearly unintentional due to the existence of the item, and detective having "gun that kills you in one shot" EVERY round is just not fun.

[jwhitak]

Live Server

Explosion Chance

If there are 6 bullets (of any type) in the gun, firing 357 illegally will have a 10% to explode, dealing 20 burn to a random organ. The gun is qdel'd in the process.
If there are 5 bullets, this increases to 20%.
If there are 4 bullets, this increases to 30%, and so on, up to the following maximum:
The maximum chance, a revolver with a single 357 bullet, fired illegally, has a 60% to explode.

Unmodified revolvers

• can be loaded with 38 and 357
• can fire 38 without issue
• can fire 357 with an explosion chance of 10%-60%, qdeling the gun

Modified revolvers (any)

• can only accept 357
• can fire 38 and 357 without issue

PR changes

Explosion odds remain the same

Unmodified revolvers

• can only accept 38
• can only fire 38

Screwdriver modified revolvers

• can only accept 357, 38 cannot be loaded and the gun must be empty to be modified
• can fire 357, with an explosion chance of 10%-60%, qdeling the gun

Tator tot kit modified revolvers

• can only accept 357
• can fire 357

[skelesexualstephen]

That explosion % chance is silly. May as well remove the ability to modify it with a screwdriver all together. All I can see now is someone like Joey slipping the detective and qdel'ing the revolver every round (which should be something the clown can/should do).

[Theophrastus1]

That explosion % chance is silly. May as well remove the ability to modify it with a screwdriver all together. All I can see now is someone like Joey slipping the detective and qdel'ing the revolver every round (which should be something the clown can/should do).

Oh, like you can do to the HoS' Lawgiver at the cost of a hand?

[BomberBro]

That'd only happen if the detective was chronically filling his revolver with 357 anyway, which is bad detective behavior. If you want to take the risk do it when it counts.

[SonixApache]

this should be merged for the sole purpose of it being an explicit (ancient/legacy/oldcoder) bugfix
it can be improved on afterwards

[jwhitak]

My initial thoughts on this PR are that the current live behavior has been like this for a decade without any further balance changes, so simply reimplementing ten year old intended code as a bugfix is probably a bad idea without actually strongly considering the impact of this thing.

For example, the up-to-60% to have your gun explode when firing a bullet is an extreme change, and for people who have played over a hundred rounds of detective and miss the changelog? It's gonna be a funny time when their gun starts exploding.

My thoughts on issues brought up. These are unsorted. Expect to find one to support your own side of this big whole argument:

1. The traitor kit is useless. It has been for ten years. Having a useless traitor item is a bad thing. Nobody disagrees with this. Separate PR should be made to allow more ammo choices into the thing.

2. 357 is pretty powerful (see below), which is why it's locked in the armory alongside all the rest of the lethal weapons. Gotta get the ammo from the Warden, who should ask why you are in violation of a Code 4 illegally modified weapon if we're going the IC route. There's a theoretical balance to it, and if the det is hacking in to get ammo/getting it from the warden, this might be a player feedback issue similarly to if a HoS gave shotguns out to sec roundstart every shift.

3. 38 vs 357. They are not the same. 10 damage vs 60 damage shots. One hit and you're done for, 60 damage hits have a 60% to cause 15 additional damage in the form of IB, and will instantly break any bone besides head/chest/groin. It will gib a hand/foot if hit, and will gib any limb with 15 or more damage already. From a SINGLE SHOT. This is a good argument for taking it away from the detectives.

4. This is fun for detective players, but it isn't fun for people getting brained point blank. Getting stunned by their weaker rounds isn't fun either, but at least you aren't immediately round removed.

5. A screwdriver shouldn't be the only tool required to mod the gun, it should require some more complicated equipment.

6. The explosion chance is kinda whacky, it scales based on how many bullets are left in your gun vs a flat chance. Leaves room for interesting play, but it's a strange mecahnic.

7. The modification removes the ability to load and fire 38 rounds, which isn't how it works in reality.

I'm currently on the stance of just merging this PR, though with the change that the modified revolver can still fire 38s.

[anonymoose-contributor]

This PR makes me crave new ammunition types for most of our firearms.

[Pastamadness]

For example, the up-to-60% to have your gun explode when firing a bullet is an extreme change, and for people who have played over a hundred rounds of detective and miss the changelog? It's gonna be a funny time when their gun starts exploding.

Strong argument to fix an old exploit.

[west3436]

@jwhitak put more effort into this in #36513 so I will close this one.

[Kromkar]

Tator tot kit modified revolvers

• can only accept 357
• can fire 357

As the owner of a .357 IRL you absolutely can shoot .38 out of it lol