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Fix conflicting spawn patterns of two STARs in KJAX #2063

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IndiaBravo opened this issue Jan 18, 2023 · 6 comments · May be fixed by #2071
Open

Fix conflicting spawn patterns of two STARs in KJAX #2063

IndiaBravo opened this issue Jan 18, 2023 · 6 comments · May be fixed by #2071
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BUGFIX Defect of the simulator, airport, or aircraft has pull request Add this label when an issue has a PR which will resolve it

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@IndiaBravo
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Browser: Chrome

Airport: KJAX - Jacksonville International

Approximate play time before issue: About 60-80 sec

Issue Description

  • The 2 airplanes on the TEBOW1 arrival (SW side of airspace) descend into each other about 15-20 seconds after entering the airspace.
  • I believe This is because both are descending via the STAR

please include any console errors and/or screenshots

Steps to reproduce

  • Reset the simulation and wait for the 2 aircraft to get into airspace and start to descend into JAX
@svalencia014
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I'll do an audit eventually since I am a ZJX controller on VATSIM and am (fairly) familiar with the procedures. One of my friends was also complaining that the MARQO2 arrivals are too high (160 instead of 120)

@svalencia014 svalencia014 self-assigned this Jan 18, 2023
@svalencia014
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I can't figure out the TEBOW guys but I updated a few things to make it match procedures in use.

@cake-pie
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cake-pie commented Jan 19, 2023

The issue raised by OP sounds like a duplicate of #934 -- the root cause is likely when the random traffic generator just happens to spawn two (or more) aircraft that are destined to collide or get into conflict and there is nothing that can be done by the time those acft become player-controllable. Solving this "properly" would require implementing logic in javascript to ensure separation of arriving aircraft at the enroute controller level, before aircraft become controllable by the player. See this discussion. As a stopgap solution, some hacking around in the airport JSON such as removing certain spawn points or STARs or adjusting spawn rates might help alleviate the problem, but that is less than ideal.

@svalencia014: as the updates you're making are not actually related to fixing this issue, it would be more appropriate to file a separate issue and have your branch name / PR reference that, instead of hijacking this issue number. (Edit: or you could just reopen #2058 and use that.)

@erikquinn
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@IndiaBravo @svalencia014 As @cake-pie has alluded to, the reason this is happening is because the sim can't "separate" any traffic... meaning it is the responbility of the airport designer to follow the guidelines needed to prevent this situation from being possible before they are well-inside approach airspace. But it's not well documented. I have created an issue to improve the documenation, #2065, the contents of which you should read for further info on how to proceed.

So this will be something that is "wrong" with the way the airport file has been created, and will need to be corrected. I will repurpose this issue for that work if one of you would like to claim it and clear up the problem.

@erikquinn erikquinn changed the title JAX Aircraft Collision Fix conflicting spawn patterns of two STARs in KJAX Jan 19, 2023
@erikquinn erikquinn added the BUGFIX Defect of the simulator, airport, or aircraft label Jan 19, 2023
@erikquinn erikquinn added this to To do in Medium Priority via automation Jan 19, 2023
@svalencia014
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svalencia014 commented Jan 20, 2023 via email

@erikquinn
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Turns out this is an issue of a spawn pattern's start location being right near the airspace boundary, where the prespawn aircraft begin. Rather than making that already-complex logic even more nightmarish, we should just extend the spawn point further out, so the existing logic will prevent this from happening.

So for KJAX, change the TEBOW spawn pattern from starting at HILIS (right outside the airspace boundary), to starting further out. I suggest using LAL..HILIS.TEBOW1.KJAX8, which I have personally confirmed resolves the problem. "LAL" : ["N27d59.17", "W82d00.83"],

@svalencia014 svalencia014 added the has pull request Add this label when an issue has a PR which will resolve it label Jan 26, 2023 — with GitHub Codespaces
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4 participants